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Post by hanzrimer on Jan 28, 2010 11:30:22 GMT -5
Really, Hanz? It appears as though you are the closed-minded one, for what I am telling you is actually rather easy to believe in, yet you refuse to accept the fact that there is a supernatural being that created you and gave you a purpose. Also, what proof do you have for NOT believing in God? Is there some way to tell if there is a God or not? No, so you should withhold judgement if you do not desire to be judged. Also, I really don't care whether you believe in God or not. You're in America, where freedom to express any religion (or opinion) is given. but again, I don't care if you're an atheist or not. Your funeral, your soul. You'll see what I mean sooner or later... On a positive note, however, I see you're from Long Island. Good man, Same here The burden of proof is on you my friend, not I. what if I told you I believe in the slime goblin. He roams the woods of Suffolk county stealing apples. I have zero proof he exists beyond my own faith but you also have zero proof he doesn't exist. It's kind of hard to single handedly prove something isn't there, all we can go with are the words of god and the bible and all of scientific discoveries kind of contradict it. like the earth isn't 5 thousand years old and evolution. so yeah, I'm leaning towards there is no god for now, unless of course you can prove other wise, same goes for my slime goblin, it doesn't exist untill there is proof, not vise verse. any way, where abouts on the Island ya from? i'm in medford.
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Post by redwurd on Jan 28, 2010 11:36:26 GMT -5
still on the great Douglas Adams quotes (GAWD I miss him)
"He hoped and prayed that there wasn't an afterlife. then he realized there was a contradiction involved here and merely hoped that there wasn't an afterlife."
People will then often say, ' But surely it's better to remain an Agnostic just in case?' This, to me, suggests such a level of silliness and muddled that I usually edge out of the conversation rather than get sucked into it. (It turns out that I've been wrong all along, and there is in fact a God, and if it further turned out that this kind of legalistic, cross-your-fingers-behind-you-back, Clintonian hair-splitting impressed him, then i think I would choose not to worship him anyway.)
"Far out in the uncharted backwaters of the unfashionable end of the Western Spiral arm of the Galaxy lies a small unregarded yellow sun. Orbiting this at a distance of roughly ninety-eight million miles is an utterly insignificant little blue-green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea."
Now it is such a bizarrely improbably coincidence that anything so mindbogglingly useful {the Babel fish} could have evolved by chance that some thinkers have chosen to see it as a final and clinching proof of the non-existence of God. The argument goes something like this: "i refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing." "But," says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. QED (Quite Easily Done) "Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic."
"Even the skeptical mind must be prepared to accept the unacceptable when there is no alternative. If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family Anatidae on our hands."
"I don't believe it. Prove it to me and I still won't believe it."
"If somebody thinks they're a hedgehog, presumably you just give 'em a mirror and a few picture of hedgehogs and tell them to sort it out for themselves."
"Watch?? I'm gonna pray, Man! Know any good religions?"
"It is known that there are an infinite number of worlds, simply because there is an infinite amount of space for them to be in. However, not every one of them is inhabited. Any finite number divided by infinity is as near nothing as makes no odds, so the average population of all the planets in the Universe can be said to be zero. From this it follows that the population of the whole Universe is also zero, and that any people you may meet from time to time are merely products of a deranged imagination."
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Post by NexsusX (Fury) on Jan 28, 2010 12:06:07 GMT -5
Okay, I get that. But, there's scientific evidence, that there were many upon many of animals here before humans, and, the first human were Neanderthals. Like Lucy. Are you saying Adam and Eve were Neanderthals? And, since you know all this stuff, Lucifer is Satan, right? Eve gave into temptation when she ate the (onyx?) apple? And they gave birth to Cain and his brother. I know the story of Cain and his brother. His brothers name was Abel? And, why did Lucifer try to test get Jesus to give into the sins? If he is the son of god, would God cast him down to hell? Or would he have. A conscience? The burden of proof is on you my friend, not I. what if I told you I believe in the slime goblin. He roams the woods of Suffolk county stealing apples. I have zero proof he exists beyond my own faith but you also have zero proof he doesn't exist. It's kind of hard to single handedly prove something isn't there, all we can go with are the words of god and the bible and all of scientific discoveries kind of contradict it. like the earth isn't 5 thousand years old and evolution. so yeah, I'm leaning to wards there is no god for now, unless of course you can prove other wise, same goes for my slime goblin, it doesn't exist until there is proof, not vise verse. any way, where abouts on the Island ya from? I'm in medford. yash & hanz I'm seeing that you heavily rely on the science of life what about the things science cant explain things like eastern medicine, acupuncture which in form expels the negative energy which accumulates inside of you and some other instances. This of course is only a smaller example and nothing compared to how gravity works ( solar eclipses instance) Science only explains how things work . So when the idea of god comes into question of course the modern scientist is going to say, "Wait a moment what created god?" "What is he made of?" "How can he exist if we cannot see him, Feel him with our own human touch?" This is one of the major reasons why scientists and religious authorities will never understand each other. Sciences works with technological world veiw in which this are seen as how they work while the other Religion works with a teleological world veiw in which you ask the question of what is its purpose. Then again its not your fault for thinking that way we live in a Cartesian society ( people who value the sciences, education and mathematics above most other things) and there is nothing wrong with that because I am in ways similar I'm not defending blitz if this is what you get out of this response all I'm trying to do is question your loyalty to the sciences people blindly trust,which in most highly developed countries most people do, Cause in a moment I will make a response about god and the bible which may seem that I am attacking him or rather attacking the principles of god and mans interpretation of it Even since the dawn of man people blindly follow one method of thinking or another when to methods contradict each other they are going to clash. religion vs religion, science vs religion, science vs science etc etc etc... people love to argue that they are in the right or they are closer to the truth until it comes to the sophist ideology of "Might makes Right" and the people with the bigger guns, the vast amount of resources, and larger amount of people who follow them till death ( in most instances) will have their way of life accepted and the loser will have their tail between their legs and fade away to either try again some time in the future or die out The reason I came up with this post was mainly to make people question themselves and defend their ideals i probably could have worded the title a bit better but I never have good luck with titles Most people live their lives without turning to experiences every single possibility in life maybe there is a god maybe there isn't or maybe theres something more that we just cannot as humans understand lolololol Btw I'm sorry if I seem to be ranting but when someone goes into saying that someone is closed minded and its responded with the other party saying the same thing, its only saying that both parties are closed minded cause, "it takes one to know one" (lol pun) Attempting to try to see things in another persons shoes without truly leaving their own is a bit annoying cause I pretty positive that I'd do the same thing that you would if i was in their position. To say anything more is to say your still putting in your opinion. oh and red I see why you love his quotes xDDD im the same way with certain philosophers
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Post by hanzrimer on Jan 28, 2010 12:39:50 GMT -5
In my opinion from what I know, eastern medicine is complete BS, like killing a rhino for it's horn for magical healing pours which of course does not work, and other crazy shit like that.
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Post by Blitzkrieg Boys on Jan 28, 2010 13:37:52 GMT -5
Eplain this, Hanz: www.youtube.com/watch?v=af0soQ-uWB0&feature=relatedHere is what the Blessed Virgin Mary revealed to us recently: "This sign will be given for the atheists. You faithful already have signs and you have become the sign for the atheists. You faithful must not wait for the sign before you convert: convert soon. This time is a time of grace for you. When the sign comes, it will be too late. As a mother I caution you because I love you. The secrets exist. My children! Nothing is known of these now, but when they are known, it will be too late. Return to prayer, nothing is more important than this. I would like it if the Lord allowed me to reveal some of the secrets to you, but that which He is doing for you is already a Grace which is almost too much." Also Red, your problen is the very thing that you have stated. You are thinking with your head, not your heart. You know there is a divine being, but human reasoning prevents you from believing. To believe in God, you must realize that the world is not black and white. You have to read between the lines to realize the shades of grey that is the mysterious. Hanz, I do not expect you to believe in the video. You of all people would claim it is in a studio of some sort, but the fact is that it is real. Do your research on Medjugorje. See what you get. I'm from the north shore, around 10 minutes away from Port Jefferson. I visit Medford alot with my basketball team though.
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Post by flee14 on Jan 28, 2010 13:46:36 GMT -5
i Believe GOD and the Bible. I'm Catholic. If you don't beilieve in God then may God let you see the light.
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Post by NexsusX (Fury) on Jan 28, 2010 15:14:54 GMT -5
In my opinion from what I know, eastern medicine is complete BS, like killing a rhino for it's horn for magical healing pours which of course does not work, and other crazy shit like that. On what grounds do you say its bullshit? Just because you don't understand the function on how something works doesn't mean its wrong. Have you tried it before? This is pretty much is showing that your closed minded on its own. Please when you make statements in the future use evidence to support your reasoning other than its your opinion cause this of course is a debate and your putting your opinion on the line which means you would have to support what you say with something that i could grasp the understanding of. If it were any other situation I would respect your opinion and keep moving on. I did not mean to offend you in anyway hanz but you put yourself in that position and I am only pointing out that fact.
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Post by [ROJOES]ronjons on Jan 28, 2010 15:26:51 GMT -5
... if I told you I believe in the slime goblin. He roams the woods of Suffolk county stealing apples. I have zero proof he exists beyond my own faith but you also have zero proof he doesn't exist... ...I'm leaning towards there is no god for now, unless of course you can prove other wise, same goes for my slime goblin, it doesn't exist untill there is proof, not vise verse... Slime Goblin Vs God. Both possibly imaginary, however God offers a first cause for everything, while Slimesey doesn't. more likely God exists. Though God's job description over the years has become more hands-off. As science expanded likelyhood of God's existence dwindled. A Flying Spaghetti Monster yesterday...
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Post by hanzrimer on Jan 28, 2010 15:36:27 GMT -5
In my opinion from what I know, eastern medicine is complete BS, like killing a rhino for it's horn for magical healing pours which of course does not work, and other crazy shit like that. On what grounds do you say its bullshit? Just because you don't understand the function on how something works doesn't mean its wrong. Have you tried it before? This is pretty much is showing that your closed minded on its own. Please when you make statements in the future use evidence to support your reasoning other than its your opinion cause this of course is a debate and your putting your opinion on the line which means you would have to support what you say with something that i could grasp the understanding of. If it were any other situation I would respect your opinion and keep moving on. I did not mean to offend you in anyway hanz but you put yourself in that position and I am only pointing out that fact. I believe in conservation of wildlife and medieval beliefs that somethings horn could could cure someone while bringing a species to extinction is complete bull shit to me. I'll use the example I said before, do you know what a rhino's horn is made of? If not then look at your hands, you have at the end of your fingers. Same exact stuff. So yeah sorry, it's bullshit. If anyone wants to continue to debate me on magical tigers paws and shark fins that's fine but as far as the whole god thing goes i'm pretty much done and I'll end it with a quote i've used before and I'll use again, "if you reason religious people there would be no religious people"
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Post by Blitzkrieg Boys on Jan 28, 2010 15:42:14 GMT -5
Ah but if you reason with an atheist, they get mad, refuse to accept there could be a God, stray from the topic and end up writing about slime monsters and rhino horns.
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Post by hanzrimer on Jan 28, 2010 15:56:08 GMT -5
when you start to reason with me that comment may make sense.
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Post by BulgarianMenace on Jan 28, 2010 16:16:44 GMT -5
there may be a god, sure. But it is just as likely as there existing a flying spaghetti monster that created the universe.
So why should anyone believe in god instead of believing in the flaying spaghetti monster?
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Post by [ROJOES]ronjons on Jan 28, 2010 18:32:03 GMT -5
there may be a god, sure. But it is just as likely as there existing a flying spaghetti monster that created the universe. So why should anyone believe in god instead of believing in the flaying spaghetti monster? If a flying spaghetti monster is self contingent (itself reason for its own existence & cause of the universe), then flying spaghetti monster may qualify as God. I'll check if there's a vacancy for it ... However there are additional qualities required for the role of God
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Post by yash3ahuja on Jan 28, 2010 19:17:41 GMT -5
This is a question unable to be answered. Though, more people are becoming athiest due to science. I actually believe in the future, most will end up as athiest.
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Post by NexsusX (Fury) on Jan 28, 2010 19:50:13 GMT -5
On what grounds do you say its bullshit? Just because you don't understand the function on how something works doesn't mean its wrong. Have you tried it before? This is pretty much is showing that your closed minded on its own. Please when you make statements in the future use evidence to support your reasoning other than its your opinion cause this of course is a debate and your putting your opinion on the line which means you would have to support what you say with something that i could grasp the understanding of. If it were any other situation I would respect your opinion and keep moving on. I did not mean to offend you in anyway hanz but you put yourself in that position and I am only pointing out that fact. I believe in conservation of wildlife and medieval beliefs that somethings horn could could cure someone while bringing a species to extinction is complete bull shit to me. I'll use the example I said before, do you know what a rhino's horn is made of? If not then look at your hands, you have at the end of your fingers. Same exact stuff. So yeah sorry, it's bullshit. If anyone wants to continue to debate me on magical tigers paws and shark fins that's fine but as far as the whole god thing goes I'm pretty much done and I'll end it with a quote I've used before and I'll use again, "if you reason religious people there would be no religious people" Its people like you who have no understanding on how a culture works that is different from your own,that cause the wars we get into. you feel as if your way of life is Superior to their's and since they cant defend themselves its open party for you. What I meant by give support to your findings is to a least spare you from a small fault you made when you made an assumption about eastern culture. I never once said that eastern cultures only used animal parts to for their medicine. Originally i was going to say it in my earlier post but i wanted to make sure that you really meant or rather made an indication that their way of life is back wards. The statement "Magical tigers" proves your way of thinking similar to what I thought you meant To say that is to show that you have no understanding of their culture or medical practices. Yes some may use rhino horns as a form of medicine and i do accept that fact but your only saying "Protect the wildlife" as a form to defend your position while under that pretense you want to say their form of life is "medieval". I'm not trying to hate on you hanz but don't respond with a funneled view of the world. Experience life more it might surprise you. on a side note I'm only passionate about this because what you say is one of the reasons why i cant say, "I'm an American" when I leave the country. we are looked with scorn (by some countries) for the simple fact that we advocate all forms of freedoms but in the end we end up being hypocrites cause some of our own people give a bad representation of us. I am not trying to say that you fall into this hanz cause you just don't have enough information. but then again why should we care cause we are "AMERICA" and we kick everyones ass. even if we are alone
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