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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 20, 2009 15:35:50 GMT -5
Well not only is the mage easier to use, a mage just has so much going for it. Heal, Firewall which covers so much ground, the triangle move (forgot the name) which deals a lot of damage, and of course the lighting with auto aim that has a decent range. besides Strider, isn't most valuable class=the best? Killing isn't everything.
I hope everyone thinks like you guys, that archers are better, I'm sick of fighting mages. I love cutting into this non healing archers, easy kills.
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Post by Strider on Nov 20, 2009 15:48:12 GMT -5
Valuable as in, they're nice to have around. The healing, shield, and firewall are all very useful tools for the team.
I threw the 'maybe' in there for a reason.
The killing power and the ability to strike/defend from a distance, make the Archer a candidate for most valuable as well. On the surface, it appears that the mage is a no-brainer for most valuable. But once examined, it's not so cut and dry.
Ultimately, I think this is an argument that cannot be won or lost. It's just opinion. No amount of testing or debating will prove one side over the other.
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 20, 2009 16:17:35 GMT -5
yes but testing can't hurt, and I feel if I defeat a whole bunch of archers with my mage, can't hurt....
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Post by BulgarianMenace on Nov 20, 2009 23:02:53 GMT -5
yet I've explained in depth about how your test is flawed, and you have no response.
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 21, 2009 14:45:57 GMT -5
Good archers could challenge me, I don't care. Just no one in the top 10 or whatever because as you would agree that wouldn't be fair as I'm a "below mediocre mage". So a below mediocre mage should lose to a good archer correct?
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Post by BulgarianMenace on Nov 21, 2009 22:39:20 GMT -5
You're still ducking my point.
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 22, 2009 12:57:20 GMT -5
You're still ducking my point. way to respond to anything I said.
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Post by BulgarianMenace on Nov 22, 2009 13:16:09 GMT -5
i c wut u did thar
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Post by Crusader_878 on Nov 22, 2009 14:27:47 GMT -5
I don't think there should be a debate about this at all. A mage has to at least get close enough to you to hurt you, including his fire wall. However, the unfair archer can kill you anywhere even on the otherside of the map, what's more with a single freaking arrow. Against an archer you have no chance of retaliation until you can get to him, and if he's a good archer: good luck. Archers ruin this game and I personally don't count their kills as a death when they kill me.
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 22, 2009 14:52:37 GMT -5
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 22, 2009 14:54:58 GMT -5
I don't think there should be a debate about this at all. A mage has to at least get close enough to you to hurt you, including his fire wall. However, the unfair archer can kill you anywhere even on the otherside of the map, what's more with a single freaking arrow. Against an archer you have no chance of retaliation until you can get to him, and if he's a good archer: good luck. Archers ruin this game and I personally don't count them as a death when they kill me. the thing about what you just said there is just about everyone agrees it takes skill to be an archer, so even if Archers are better, it still takes skill to be one, and you are basically saying it doesn't. Or at least that's what I got from that.
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Post by Crusader_878 on Nov 22, 2009 15:07:34 GMT -5
I don't think there should be a debate about this at all. A mage has to at least get close enough to you to hurt you, including his fire wall. However, the unfair archer can kill you anywhere even on the otherside of the map, what's more with a single freaking arrow. Against an archer you have no chance of retaliation until you can get to him, and if he's a good archer: good luck. Archers ruin this game and I personally don't count them as a death when they kill me. the thing about what you just said there is just about everyone agrees it takes skill to be an archer, so even if Archers are better, it still takes skill to be one, and you are basically saying it doesn't. Or at least that's what I got from that. I've never used an archer and I never will, so I couldn't tell you if the archer is easier to use than the mage. But in my opinion, no class compares to the unfair archer. Archers have no range limits, all the other classes do.
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 22, 2009 19:13:35 GMT -5
the thing about what you just said there is just about everyone agrees it takes skill to be an archer, so even if Archers are better, it still takes skill to be one, and you are basically saying it doesn't. Or at least that's what I got from that. I've never used an archer and I never will, so I couldn't tell you if the archer is easier to use than the mage. But in my opinion, no class compares to the unfair archer. Archers have no range limits, all the other classes do. that's not true, they have range limits, do you honestly think archers can literally shoot from across a map? only pelanor fields or sort of the shire, but other wise there is walls or something in the way, plus the further someone is the harder it is to shoot them. Either way it doesn't matter, mages give me the most problems, and apparently archers annoy others more. if you ever see me in a room feel free to a pick an archer over mage and I'll try and do the same for you, deal? Any way, I want to apologize to Joppi, my comments were unwarranted and I guess just due to annoyance of this topic and whatever, so I'm sorry. also to BM, i suggest we call it a truce and this back and forth jabbing at each other. I think it's gone long enough and just needs to end. I think in the future we should respect others opinions and not resort to insults. I just want to be cool with everyone here, Video games are supposed to be fun, not filled with all this nonsense, so there is no reason to bring it on this forum. I think on this issue we should just agree to disagree. I think we're both stubborn and should just give it a rest.
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Post by BulgarianMenace on Nov 22, 2009 19:16:54 GMT -5
There's agreeing to disagree, and then there's I'm making legit point and you can't think of anything to say so you're ignoring them.
Heck, in your response to crusader just now you ignored the whole list of maps in which archers line of sight is not significantly inhibited, which contradicts your statement about "only on pelennor or sort of the shire."
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Post by hanzrimer on Nov 22, 2009 19:19:44 GMT -5
What maps would those be? Even if you could see across the entire map there is always places to go where an archer can't hit you. It's not like an archer can hit anyone at any time, there is always somewhere to go. Archers rules at distance, duh. But they are complete crap in close range unless you are a very skilled archer, and you're fighting someone who doesn't know what they are doing. I tried ending this but you just like don't want to I guess? i never said archer's aren't good, they are, so are mages, so are warriors if you know how to use them right.
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